Episode 43 What are Energetic Cords and How to Cut them, Interview with Michele Lundstrom

[CHRIS McDONALD]

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Welcome to the Holistic Counseling Podcast, where you discover diverse wellness modalities, advice on growing your integrative practice, and grow confidence in being your unique self. I'm your host, Chris McDonald. I'm so glad you're here for the journey.

Welcome to today's episode of the Holistic Counseling Podcast. I'm your host, Chris McDonald. If you're a new listener to this podcast, I want to say welcome. As a listener, you have access to my free nine-part email course, Becoming A Holistic Counselor. In this course, you'll explore different holistic strategies, how to develop your skills as a holistic counselor and how to attract your ideal holistic client. Go to www.holisticcounselingpodcast.com, scroll down, enter your name and email address today.

Back to today's episode. Have you had days where you continue to think about a client long after the session is over? Do you have trouble disconnecting from certain clients? I know I do at times. Today's guest is here today to talk about what our energetic cords and will share some strategies on cord cutting. Michelle Lundstrom is a licensed mental health counselor in private practice and intuitive empath. She specializes in working with empaths. She is also trained as an empath coach, intuitive reader, energy healer of lightning medicine, shamanic practitioner, Advanced Chakredy, I think I said it right.

[MICHELE LUNDSTROM]

Yes

[CHRIS]

Thank you, Michelle. Advanced Chakredy practitioner and Reiki master. Welcome to the Holistic Counseling Podcast, Michelle.

[MICHELLE]

Oh, thank you so much for having me on.

[CHRIS]

Can you share with my listeners a little bit more about yourself and your work?

[MICHELLE]

Sure. Yes, so I've always been incredibly intuitive and so it was only natural that my private practice for mental health incorporates in intuition. And over the last few years, I've shifted to specializing and working with empaths and highly sensitive persons. Then I have another business where I offer intuitive and psychic readings. I do chakra readings, empath coaching, coaching for intuitive therapists, shamanic practitioner support, and I also do energy art.

[CHRIS]

I know I told you before we hit record that I'm really excited about that, but we're not here to talk about energy art today, but I'm hoping we can do a podcast in the future, because that is something I want to incorporate as well. Some of the retreats, I hope to do some holistic retreats in the future for mental health therapists and include some yoga mindfulness, breathwork but also have an art component.

[MICHELLE]

Yes.

[CHRIS]

Wouldn't that be amazing?

[MICHELLE]

That would be so amazing.

[CHRIS]

I feel like that's such an important part of holistic healing.

[MICHELLE]

It really is, the creativity, yes.

[CHRIS]

Absolutely. But we digress. So we'll get today's topic. So I want to ask you about the certified advance shake..., I can't say this word.

[MICHELLE]

Chakredy

[CHRIS]

Chakredy practitioner. So I've never heard of this. So can you share a little bit more about that?

[MICHELLE]

Yes. I trained with Alexis Saludos who is absolutely amazing and she does remedies and she does chakra work. So she put that together and came up with Chakredy. It's an intuitive way of really looking at the chakras and finding out kind of what they're needing to tell us, which helped me to kind of further develop how to look at where the energetic cords are in someone or where they're getting corded or cording into other people.

[CHRIS]

Okay, great. I know that was something we're going to talk about today. So I know a lot of listeners may be questioning what is an energetic cord? What is she talking about? So can you share more about what that is?

[MICHELLE]

Oka, so we've all heard the term like in mainstream language, no strings attached or cut the ties.

[CHRIS]

Yes.

[MICHELLE]

So that's a little bit what we're talking about in that we all kind of intuitively know this, but we don't really talk about it in our culture. So if you want to think about the concept of an energetic cord, one way to think about that is like, think of a toaster. You can take it and walk it around your house and plug it into any outlet you want to. You can choose where you want. If that counter's not working, you could take it up to your living room or something. But however you plug it into the wall, you get to choose which outlet and you get to pull energy then from that outlet and then your toaster becomes functional. But us as human beings, we don't need to cord into others to be functional. We have our own internal battery and our internal energy. So there are times though, when people will cord into others, and this happens frequently for us as therapists where it can be from anything innocent and loving to something malicious or harmful and an entire spectrum in between.

[CHRIS]

So is there certain type of people that tend to have stronger energy cords to us?

[MICHELLE]

We typically, so one way to tell if you've been corded in is if you're like on an obsessive thought loop about somebody or you just can't quit thinking about them. That's usually a really good indication that we've been corded into. So an example that I see sometimes in my therapy practice is in unhealthy marriages. Like you can even hear the cord go in in that statement of I only feel safe if I'm around this person. Some partners will say something like you could never support yourself without me or no one else could ever love you. I was like, that's that moment, our words have power. That's that moment someone is corded in, usually into the lower three chakras. And these things that people say become that representation of what happens when somebody is trying to control you and cord into those lower chakras.

[CHRIS]

So this happens even for people in relationships?

[MICHELLE]

This happens in relationships. When we have clients that come in that are just on this constant thought loop about a client, I always say, if you're thinking about a client when you're changing your cat litter or when you're just doing your dishes or the regular mundane things, there's a high likelihood that, that client either corded into you or you corded into them. That can go both ways.

[CHRIS]

So how do we know if we've corded into someone?

[MICHELLE]

Well, sometimes we cord in because we would just really want to take care of them. As a therapist we're like really nurturing people and mothers do this, hopefully yes, but mothers do this all the time. So when a child is young, they need to be corded into us in order to feel secure. There's safety in there. But around the age 10 or 12, this can start to create problems. If the child is healthy and once they're autonomy, they're going to start pulling against the parent that's corded into them. Usually that's a sacred, like right at the Naval belly button to sacred connection. The child no longer wants to feel like an extension of the parent. So cutting the cords moves that focus to like your heart, like, I can just love you. I can let you be autonomous and I can give you unconditional love. And those lower shock cords to the child or to anyone is going to feel like manipulation and control.

[CHRIS]

So I wonder if, in meshed parents, if they're too enmeshed with their kids, if that could be a strong cord they have

[MICHELLE]

Yes, any relationship where we feel enmeshed is that when it's not that caretaking. Like I saw a young child, we want to be corded into, that's some of those really natural ways that we cord or a young kitten or a young puppy in your care when they're very young and they need that to feel kind of grounded here and connected and not like they're floating off in the ethers. But even adults will come to me and say that they're feeling controlled by a parent. I'm sure we've all kind of heard this. They're likely to have a first or second chakra cord that's just never been removed. And they don't have to remove the person from their life. In fact, when we remove the cord we can shift out of that relationship of feeling controlled and into one where there's unconditional love and pending the person is safe for you.

[CHRIS]

Of course. So I'm wondering if there's some negative effects if we don't cut these cords to us, like mentally, physically, spiritually.

[MICHELLE]

Yes, we can get really drained. It's exhausting. Because sometimes those cords, oftentimes as therapist, if we're feeling really drained at the end of our therapy day and we're not energized from all of the amazing work, hopefully that we've done throughout the day, then likely it's because of cording. Clients will cord into us and sometimes again, we cord into them but when we're connected at that, those lower three chakras it's particularly draining and you can start to feel exhaustion from that. That's a good sign too. So that mental obsession, the mental thought loops, the physically being drained is another sign that maybe you're corded into somebody else.

[CHRIS]

Because I would think that if a therapist sees six, seven clients a day and they had cords connected to everybody day in day out that yes, I could see how that would totally be overwhelming and draining.

[MICHELLE]

Yes. Which is part of my mission to like create awareness around energetic cords, especially in the therapist community. Because we are more, we're there to kind of take care of and support and help our clients for that therapeutic hour. But of course that feels good so a lot of clients are going to cord into us even when they're not there, like they're having a hard day and they're thinking about something that we taught them or something that we learned and they just kind of have that ability to energetically cord in.

[CHRIS]

So I wonder if empath and highly sensitive people, are they more sensitive to the energetic cords and other people?

[MICHELLE]

Yes, especially as I've practiced. So I'm an empath and I'll feel like, it feels like a really grippy or grasping energy. I can feel now, because I keep my feel clear of cords, I can feel if somebody cords into me. I can feel it in that moment. So

[CHRIS]

That's like a sensitivity to that you've developed?

[MICHELLE]

It's a sensitivity that I've developed, but it's something everyone can develop with practice. I think it's a little bit easier for empaths because there's that internal awareness, because we start to get information. The solar plexus chakra has a lot to do with our gut knowing and our intuition. So we can kind of feel a lot of that happening in those lower chakras, not necessarily a cognition, but just that sense of knowing.

[CHRIS]

The sense of knowing that I'm being corded into right now.

[MICHELLE]

Right, that I'm feeling drained. This feels like needy. Like there's something that's feeling needy about this person. That's usually a good sign too. We live in a culture that has so much energy of like fear and scarcity and it kind of sets this up because if we live in a state of trust that everything that I need is going to be provided for me, no matter what, then there's never any need for me to cord into someone else. So if you think about it, anyone who's in that space of fear or scarcity is highly likely to be trying to cord into other people around them.

[CHRIS]

Could that be even from strangers?

[MICHELLE]

That could be from strangers. The other day I was working with a salesperson and they've actually, I think unconsciously learned how to cord into people to make sales.

[CHRIS]

Oh, wow.

[MICHELLE]

He like kept looking into my eyes and he kept saying, Michelle, he kept saying my name, and I was just like, oh, this, like, I kept feeling him cord into me. And I'm like, I want to buy this product, but I don't want to buy it from you.

[CHRIS]

Which turned you off. It was the opposite of what you wanted.

[MICHELLE]

It was the opposite. Because when we're in that place of like, this is my autonomy, this is my physical body, like you don't get to come in here and try and manipulate and control me.

[CHRIS]

Interesting. I never thought of it for a salesperson.

[MICHELLE]

I mean, and it could just be like the person at the coffee shop. We get a lot of these cords that are just kind of, I call them the insignificant cords, and that's why I think a daily cord clearing meditation for all cords is helpful. Because we pick them up out in the world. We cord into each other for understanding and communication, which was great but before we had language, but now that we have language, we don't really need to be doing that all the time.

[CHRIS]

So you mentioned there's a meditation for that. So is there other ways that therapists can cut some of these energetic cords?

[MICHELLE]

There's a lot of different ways. Selenite wands are or a good way if you're into crystals and stuff. It's an amazing stone to just kind of run over your body with the intention. So intention is the powerhouse of clearing cords. Because if your intention is in that I have my autonomy, this is my body. This is my energetic field. As you wave that selenite wand and you're clearing those cords off of you, the intention of combined with the amazing properties of that stone will help you to clear those.

[CHRIS]

Very cool. Where is there a meditation on that though, you said to use for energetic clearing?

[MICHELLE]

There's a lot of different ones on YouTube that are free. I can walk you guys through a quick one if you'd like to have an experience.

[CHRIS]

Absolutely.

[MICHELLE]

Okay. All right. Well let's just ---

[CHRIS]

Make sure if you're driving though, that you pull over.

[MICHELLE]

Yes, yes. Do not close your eyes and do this meditation while you're driving. If you're driving, just listen to it for cognitive awareness. Because I know I listen to your podcast while I'm driving a lot. So just go ahead and close your eyes if you're in a space that you can do that and just kind of taking a breath and if you take that breath in, I want you to go right below your button and focus your attention inward. We're just going to focus on that second chakra. You may see it like a flower or a spinning energy vortex and just notice the very first thought of who you notice may be corded in with you in the chakra and just allow your inner self to bring someone to mind that you often attach to, or that attaches to you.

If you're not getting anything, just make somebody up and let's focus on just one person for now because you may notice several in there. It could be somebody that you lose your sense of identity with. It could be somebody you worry about all the time, someone you think you can't live without. Just imagine that first person and call on a very deep part of yourself that can say an inner no. I'm holding up my hand right now like a Stop sign. I'm just imagining in our mind's eyes that we can say, no, you cannot be in my field. You cannot cord into me.

And just imagine magical scissors or a sword or anything that resonates for you to cut this cord. Just setting the intention and the energetic boundary. If you feel like you don't want to cut it, because I feel like there's some people out there that are maybe worried about cutting that cord with somebody, just move that cord up to your heart and transfer it with love; maybe saying, "I love you and I still want you in my life. I'm just moving you to my heart so I don't get lost anymore." Just stay open to what comes up for you. You are returning the autonomy of your own chakra, your own wholeness where no one else can reach in or control your energy without your permission, saying to yourself, I am reclaiming my body, my energy. I am no longer available to be corded or controlled by you. You can hold your hand up again and say no and set that energetic boundary. I am reclaiming my own authority. Go ahead and take a breath and come back

[CHRIS]

Wow. That's powerful.

[MICHELLE]

Yes.

[CHRIS]

I can feel lighter even just doing that.

[MICHELLE]

It's amazing, the shift.

[CHRIS]

Oh, here's a weird thing that happened for me with doing that. I had a dream last night about somebody that I don't know if I've met them, but I felt that person come up as energetic cord. Is that weird?

[MICHELLE]

Not at all. Not at all. Yes, that can happen. People can cord in through our dreams as well.

[CHRIS]

That's what I wondered. I thought this is weird. Why am I not thinking of a person that I know of? So strange.

[MICHELLE]

Well that's the awareness. That's the one that wanted to surface. That's the one your chakra was like, can we deal with this one first?

[CHRIS]

Yes, absolutely. I guess I had another question about types of people that might cord us. I'm thinking like energy vampires. If somebody is like that, does that mean that they have strong, I guess tendency to cord on people?

[MICHELLE]

Yes, energy vampires are the ones you tend to most feel energetically drained with. So it's not just that I need your support or I'm wanting your nurturing. It's a little bit more of that energy of manipulation. You'll feel incredibly exhausted around that person. Like they're literally sucking the power out of your chakra. And usually they'll cord into the lower three chakras.

[CHRIS]

Ok. So some people are just have that tendency more than others, I guess, based on their own needs?

[MICHELLE]

Some people do and some people are really good at it and some people do it knowingly. I know of gurus that will purposely cord into people in order to get people to keep coming back. That's on the very malicious end, but they'll also be draining the energy.

[CHRIS]

So I know you mentioned malicious, so I guess is that one of the malicious ways. Is there other malicious ways that people may use it?

[MICHELLE]

I think anything malicious in my personal opinion is when it's like on purpose. Like you know that you're trying to manipulate or control this person. Whether you're courting or not but if you're trying to control another person for your own your own selfishness or your own needs to be met.

[CHRIS]

So I guess crossing, is it crossing ethical boundaries maybe too?

[MICHELLE]

Absolutely. I mean that's energy ethics. Is that we don't enter another person's field. Even when I'm doing psychic readings, I never enter into the other person's field. I come alongside it and I read what their energy wants to tell me so that they can keep whatever secrets they want to keep. It's about respecting the other person's autonomy, their sovereignty.

[CHRIS]

Okay. Well, that's good to know that there's, at least you know that you can, if somebody does something malicious that you can still cut these cords.

[MICHELLE]

Yes, you don't have to let anyone control you. I see this a lot with, where clients will come in and just have like somebody that maybe they had a sexual interaction with or will still be obsessively thinking about them and they're not interested in them. Like they know logically, like this is not a good person for me. When we do that cord cutting work, the thought loops finally stop. They can stop thinking about person on repeat. And oftentimes when people are doing it more maliciously they'll re-cord back into them. So having those skills, not just cutting cords for people, but being able to teach them and empower them, like the meditation, we just did a moment ago to be able to cut their own cords or to call in supportive beings, like arch angel Michael is a common one.

[CHRIS]

That's what I've heard of.

[MICHELLE]

Or Jesus. Like when we need help, when it's a more difficult cord. And part of the reason that we did the boundary setting and the energetic boundary of that stop sign and saying no, and oh no is that we're setting that up to say you don't get to keep cording into me. No one can cord to us without our permission. But we don't consciously carry this awareness in our culture because this isn't taught. I wish this was taught in every kindergarten class.

[CHRIS]

I only learned it through one of my friends who was psychic and then I took panic healing and they teach you how to cut energetic cords. So it's like pretending that your hand is like a sword or something and cutting, doing circle across your whole body and to actually cut those when, after you do a session with someone. That's why I wondered if there was some of these practices that therapists should do on a daily basis. I would think that you wouldn't want to wait to like the end of the week because you can have all these cords connected.

[MICHELLE]

I do a big one every night. That takes maybe 10, 15 minutes. I'm not talking about a big time consuming thing. Between every session I will, whether it's a psychic greeting or a therapy session, I will use either the selenite wands or do like a really cool quick imagery scan of my energy field and cut any cords that need to be cut. Now, when I'm doing that with a client, I'm very intentional about sending love down both ends of the cord, because I want to care for them. I want to support them, but that's not the way that's healthy for me or for them to do that. So that helps to kind of do that in a way that doesn't like, if they are intuitive or empathic, because I have a lot of empathic clients that they don't feel that severing.

[CHRIS]

That's a good reminder to do it with love.

[MICHELLE]

We always want to do this with love. Even if it's somebody like the salesperson, I still did it with love. When I cut the cords, I claimed like I get my autonomy and you get to have yours, but you don't get to be in my field and I really don't want to be entangled in yours. I cut those cords. So it wasn't like the same lovey kind of energy I would give to somebody that I'm caring for but it's still like, it's kind. It's honoring you're you and I am me.

[CHRIS]

Do you ever teach this practice to clients as well?

[MICHELLE]

I do, yes. I teach this frequently, especially because I was getting really frustrated in the processing part of like when people would get an anxious thought loops that didn't have a mental health condition that would necessarily preclude that that would be a common problem for them. So processing it, I found people were just getting more ingrained in those thought loops. But when we stop and we do a two or three minute cord cutting, they get that relief feeling that you were kind of talking about after we did the meditation and the thought loop stops.

[CHRIS]

Interesting, isn't it?

[MICHELLE]

It's so powerful. This is a natural part of who we are. So it makes sense to me that would be taught in therapy and that people can learn. And you can shift and adjust the language to whatever a person's belief system is to honor who they are.

[CHRIS]

Oh, that's good. I'm glad you mentioned that because I think that's important because not everybody may have the same belief system about this

[MICHELLE]

I always approach that in therapy from whatever the person's belief system is. So if Jesus is really important to them, like we'll do the cord cutting where I'll kind of create a meditation that we're bringing Jesus into create any, cut, any ropes between them and the other person. I'll just shift the language up to make it something that is going to help them and support them, but also feels aligned with their belief system.

[CHRIS]

I know you mentioned that you use intuition with clients and sessions as well. Can you share a little bit how you do that?

[MICHELLE]

A lot of times I just know kind of why someone is blocked. Or an example that happened earlier today was somebody came in and they were like, "I'm just stuck. I don't even know what to talk about." All of a sudden, an image flashed in my mind and I was like, okay, I think I know where we're going. So I just started asking them questions around that. This is a client that I can say, hey, I just had this image in my mind. Is this something to talk about?

She was like, oh my gosh, yes, I almost forgot to talk about that. So, I mean, there's so many times that that can be so helpful in guiding the questions that I ask. If someone were watching me doing intuitive therapy, they would probably wouldn't necessarily know what I was doing because it's guiding all of my questions in the background. So it's like, instead of giving like I do in a psychic reading where I would just kind of tell the person, this is what's coming through, this is what I'm seeing, I use it to inform my questions and how I ask my questions to kind of get to the information that is going to help them on their healing journey.

[CHRIS]

That's really cool though how you have it in the background, that image, and then just allow that to guide your questions. It sounds like you can cut through a lot too, of trying to figure out what they need to work on.

[MICHELLE]

Yes, it makes it so much easier.

[CHRIS]

More efficient

[MICHELLE]

Yes, it's more efficient. And a lot of times it helps me to make connections. So sometimes these trigger an anxiety and they don't know why and I suddenly get a flash of something they told me like too months ago. I can kind of ask, does this feel similar to that situation? So they don't necessarily know that I'm tapping into intuition, but usually the response is like, oh my gosh, yes, this feels exactly the same and it really pushes us forward with processing that and kind of identifying, okay, this is where that anxiety is coming from.

[CHRIS]

So how do you work with empaths and highly sensitive people? I know that was one of your focus in your practice.

[MICHELLE]

A lot of times empaths and HSPs get frustrated with people not understanding them or feeling misunderstood because we tend to have really big emotions, which is great when it's happy emotions, like get really big excitement and really big joy. But on the flip side, when it's anxiety or someone hurt your feelings, that's a lot harder to process when we store all of that stuff and feeling memory in a really deep way that's little bit different than a neurotypical person. So being able to work with that and understand that and help them to use some of these energetic tools like cord cutting and setting energetic boundaries, and some of those things that not all therapists know how to work with and help them to not feel and absorb everything that they're feeling or experiencing in their environment.

[CHRIS]

So how do you teach how to set energetic boundaries?

[MICHELLE]

Again, it really depends on kind of what the person's belief system is and kind of where they're at, but it's about again, intention. Intention is so powerful and so key here of creating some sort of barrier, whether that's through universal light or the sun or the earth, and just bringing that energy in to create like a bubble. And a bubble of light, a transparent bubble, I think of like a soap bubble, oftentimes. Adults like that analogy. And setting the intention, because we're kind of programming the boundary around our aura of anything that is good, that really good yummy love energy can come right in and I'll feel that all day. But anger or any of the energies that don't feel good to me or that I don't need to absorb in my energy field, that just hit that energetic boundary and give me an alert and a sense of knowing, but not come into my nervous system. That offers a little protection.

The other thing I like to teach is if you put your hand right on your solar plexus, which is right above the belly button, that's our kind of intuitive center that gives us all those gut feelings that we talk about. You ask very clearly, asking your internal wisdom, is this mine or is this theirs? Does this belong to me? And there'll be that inner knowing of yes or no, mine or theirs. When it's not yours, then teaching grounding, teaching exercises to help them to release that energy so that they're not holding all of that anymore so that in therapy, like we only have to deal with their energy and not everyone else's

[CHRIS]

Those are some great strategies. I love how you talk about the bubble as like a soap bubble. I think that's really helpful for people to visualize.

[MICHELLE]

Yes, because we don't want to be invisible in the world either. I'll tell you a funny story. I put up this really solid, energetic boundary because I was just feeling like I needed to have some extra protection. I went to the grocery store and I had like two people hit me with grocery cards and I was like, what is going on? Then I went into a meeting and I said something that I thought was pretty helpful to the situation and everyone ignored me and five minutes later somebody said it and everybody's like, yes, that's what we need to do. I was like, oh, I'm invisible.

[CHRIS]

Oh, wow.

[MICHELLE]

Yes. So that's why I say always have that translucent. We don't want to protect ourself with titanium. We want to have the intention and the loving boundary of here's what I'm allowing and here's what I'm not.

[CHRIS]

So being specific with that too.

[MICHELLE]

Being very specific and add anything that you want to that. That helps you throughout your day.

[CHRIS]

Okay. So what's the takeaway you could share today that could help listeners who are starting their holistic journey?

[MICHELLE]

If you're still thinking about your clients, when you're changing your cat litter or doing your dishes, do a cord cutting. I recommend a cord cutting every single day just to take care of and reclaim your own autonomy. Your energy field is yours.

[CHRIS]

Michelle, what's the best way for listeners to find you?

[MICHELLE]

My therapy practice is at luminoushope.com. My other business is Luminous Ignus, I-G-N-U-S. That's where I offer support for therapists who are learning how to weave in their intuition into sessions as well as do cord cutting specifically for people. I also have a special offer for you guys if you want to hear it. I've decided to offer fair prices for 30 days after this airs to anyone who emails me and we can do a half hour cord cutting or just a kind of a consultation or coaching about weaving intuition in specific to them because everyone has different needs.

[CHRIS]

Fantastic. Thank you for offering that.

[MICHELLE]

You're welcome.

[CHRIS]

Have I missed anything else you wanted to share?

[MICHELLE]

I don't think so. I think we covered it.

[CHRIS]

We have a lot of good stuff on here, but I want to thank you so much for coming on with this topic, Michelle. I've been wanting to do this for a while.

[MICHELLE]

Oh, wonderful. Yes, cord cutting is so important.

[CHRIS]

I will send you a link so we can look at maybe doing some kind of art healing episode if you're up for them.

[MICHELLE]

Oh, I would love that. That would be fantastic.

[CHRIS]

I want to thank my listeners for tuning into today's episode. If you haven't joined my Facebook group, join today. It's the holistic counseling and self care group for an amazing supportive and informative group. Also, please, please rate and review wherever you get your podcast. This is Chris McDonald, sending each one of you much light and love. Until next time, take care.

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